I just got this email from the HHMI news office. What information do you think would be most useful for the BBC to post?


Dear David:

Jim Keeley asked me to follow up on the suggestion from a Rosetta@home participant that folks who may not qualify for the BBC's Climate Change project might be interested in Rosetta@home.

I have spoken with Frances McNamara, the BBC producer responsible for Climate Change, http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/hottopics/climatechange/, and she has agreed to put a link to Rosetta@home on the BBC's Climate Change project page.


She asked that we send her the following sometime in the next week or so.
brief lay language explanation of Roseta@home and its importance
exact link to be posted on BBC webpage
"computer specifics and details"
contact for folks visiting BBC website who want more info or want to sign up
Also we should supply a Rosetta@home contact name and e-mail for BBC staff

Ms. McNamara did not specifically ask for, but I think it would be useful to include, info on who/what computers would qualify for Rosetta@home, but not Climate Change.

Much of this info is already on your webpage, but might you want to gather it or might you want to develop a webpage which answers all her questions specifically for folks who link to you from the BBC website ?

Sincerely,
Cindy

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agreed to put a link to Rosetta@home on the BBC's Climate Change project page.

FANTASTIC news!

Might I suggest a new landing point on the Rosetta site specifically to greet these climate users? That first impression would then be tailored to the goal of drawing in THAT target audience.

Perhaps we could draw an anology between the need for DC in climate change, and the need in protein modeling? The climate change experiments (I believe) are tinkering with various variables in their equations and seeing which play out the closest to reality. This seems very similar to how Rosetta tests and tinkers with changes to the algorythm, and we play it out a few million times on our PCs and report back results... and you see whether the new changes "play out" well, or not.

Ms. McNamara did not specifically ask for, but I think it would be useful to include, info on who/what computers would qualify for Rosetta@home, but not Climate Change.

As I read it, they DID ask for "computer specifics and details". But, again, if tailored to be of specific use by the climate users on a special page, that will help them become more quickly "acclimated" :) to Rosetta, I think we'll draw more in.

[edit] Some day perhaps we'll model a similar landing page for the Einstein participants too!

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It this question that get me
'info on who/what computers would qualify for Rosetta@home, but not Climate Change.'

Now the BBC CCE experiment says it is for Braodband only and I can tell you as a dial-up user in the UK that BBC CCE is much lighter on the connection than Rosetta so you will need to state this project is broadband only.

and that is the other point...
Rosetta is no better the BBC CCE on the hardware either.

So the only target you actually have is people that would rather do 'health' style stuff than 'climate'.

You'll need to use real lamen terms as well, plain english (if possible).
Keep the 'what we are technically doing' till later but take the stance of helping find better ways to improve health style.

Of course you'll be link on the largest TV station in th UK (hey all of us UK people have to pay them money to have any TV recieving equipment in our homes). One of the most popular websites on the web as well.

It just we cannot technically offer people anything that are not eligable of running BBC CCE.
For dial-up users it a no no, something like Einstein or Seti is much better for them.

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Team mauisun.org

So the only target you actually have is people that would rather do 'health' style stuff than 'climate'.

Well, you can also target the climate users over to Rosetta once their project winds down... or when you finish your first WU :) I think the same page can serve both purposes. Perhaps even point out that they can crunch BOTH.

(whoops? Wasn't there something about problems running BOINC AND the BBC standalone app??)

The main thing would be memory requirements. BBC Climate is basically 1GB recommendation, and Rosetta runs in 512MB.

I was thinking of suggesting that at the bottom of Rosetta reqs on such a landing page, perhaps add a link to the BOINC Wiki on choosing a project and suggest that if they feel they CAN'T do Rosetta, they consider other BOINC projects. Someday what we send around will come around too. Or, perhaps send them specifically to WCG to crunch their Rosetta work? Sorta keep 'em in the family? :)

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That's incredible news. The number of new users and hosts is going to skyrocket. I'm looking forward to watching the numbers.

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Founder of BOINC GROUP - Objectivists - Philosophically minded rational data crunchers.

Actually this is not quite correct.

First, CPDN no longer supports Mac computers in any form, and Rosetta is VERY Mac friendly and has been through all the errors of the last few weeks. Second the memory requirements for CPDN are MORE than Rosetta at the current time.

The dial-up issue is significantly lessened here by use of the time setting, once people know how to use it. Currently this has been hard set to a max of 24 hours to help the 1% errors, but this will soon change. After that a person will be able to load a single WU and run it for 4 days. Not one of the other projects can match that.

CPDN has always had a requirement for large downloads and people have been using it on modem connections since the first day. Sorry but bandwidth will always be a problem for some people, and I would not miss this opportunity based on that issue.

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I'm looking forward to watching the numbers.

...help us SELL 'em on crunching Rosetta.

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Yes, I agree w/ F.Chicken - you should approach them w/ the idea that this is an ongoing project that will require help for some time to come...

David, you should offer to do an interview on the BBC to explain the purpose of Rosetta@home, etc. Perhaps we could garner some of their 200K clients after the CPDN finishes the first phase in the near future....we need 'em.

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Yes, I agree w/ F.Chicken - you should approach them w/ the idea that this is an ongoing project that will require help for some time to come...

David, you should offer to do an interview on the BBC to explain the purpose of Rosetta@home, etc. Perhaps we could garner some of their 200K clients after the CPDN finishes the first phase in the near future....we need 'em.

Yeah, imagine if you guys could get all of those crunchers notified to come to Rosetta once their climate project is over....wow.

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Founder of BOINC GROUP - Objectivists - Philosophically minded rational data crunchers.

Yeah, imagine if you guys could get all of those crunchers notified to come to Rosetta once their climate project is over....wow.

That's just it. I doubt R@H is easier for smaller computers or those w/ dial up than CPDN, but I think the goals of R@H are as compelling as CPDN (more so, I'd wager). Many folks want to do something to help out (perhaps not a whole lot, but something) and here's the way they can.

We need more press. I've asked the local NPR radio station to look into it. Does anyone know someone at NPR's Science Friday or CBC's Quirks and Quarks to help spread the word? Perhaps someone knows a producer on these shows - or perhaps on BBC or ABC or some other radio network that hosts a science show....? DB's pretty good on the radio...

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First we are talking BBC CCE not CPDN (though it is in the end for CPDN and run by then)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/hottopics/climatechange/
So memory is only 512Mb as it is here, there is also a Linux client though as you see we can target Mac OS-X users (though only PPC not Intel yet)


The downlaod and upload is FAR less for BBC CCE than rosetta, first Rosetta is a constant daily thing (or by default every four hours). BBC CCE is a similar sized one time download and then irregualar say monthly uploads (though a few MB in size)

This would have to be clasiffied as a broadband only project to the BBC audience.

Also you cannot run both at once, from the point of view of BBC audience.
They'll have to install Boinc, Rosetta and then attach to BBC CCE.
You cannot just get BBC CCE then attach to Rosetta, they use a simiplified setup of boinc. Be carfull in the wording.

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Team mauisun.org

We need more press. I've asked the local NPR radio station to look into it. Does anyone know someone at NPR's Science Friday or CBC's Quirks and Quarks to help spread the word? Perhaps someone knows a producer on these shows - or perhaps on BBC or ABC or some other radio network that hosts a science show....? DB's pretty good on the radio...

You may want to look at the BBC Click program http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/click_online/

The BBC flagship tech show, though only runs on BBC News 24 as far as I know, it should gather a large enough audience.

You may also want to try New Scientist Magazine, large worldwide circulation. UK equivelent to Scientific America
http://www.newscientist.com/

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Team mauisun.org

Yeah, imagine if you guys could get all of those crunchers notified to come to Rosetta once their climate project is over....wow.

That's just it. I doubt R@H is easier for smaller computers or those w/ dial up than CPDN, but I think the goals of R@H are as compelling as CPDN (more so, I'd wager). Many folks want to do something to help out (perhaps not a whole lot, but something) and here's the way they can.

We need more press. I've asked the local NPR radio station to look into it. Does anyone know someone at NPR's Science Friday or CBC's Quirks and Quarks to help spread the word? Perhaps someone knows a producer on these shows - or perhaps on BBC or ABC or some other radio network that hosts a science show....? DB's pretty good on the radio...

I suggested the Coast to Coast show to Baker some weeks back but don't know if anything came from it. That's the program that at one time spawned one of the top SETI teams because of radio interviews.

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Founder of BOINC GROUP - Objectivists - Philosophically minded rational data crunchers.

Does anyone out there have the knowledge required to create an applet which would examine the PC's operating system, processor speed, internet speed, memory, disk, etc. and report back a simple assessment as to whether this PC is going to be a viable Rosetta cruncher? Even if it weren't available in a week, such could be added to this BBC landing page at a later date and help make the assessment process very easy. Could later be used on an easy install CD for Rosetta, and added to Rosetta's HW reqs page.

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a simple assessment as to whether this PC is going to be a viable Rosetta cruncher?

But, what's a "viable Rosetta cruncher"? I'd say P4/2GHz with 512MB RAM and broadband Internet with current 2hr/WU defaults (to be on the safe side).

Project system requirements call for a 500MHz PC. I expect many such PCs will be struggling over the next few days, effectively stuck on the *_largescale_large_fullatom_relax_* WUs.

Smaller PCs, running a 8hrs/day are perfectly viable to crunch the smaller "10min per model on P4" WUs. I'd say, let people start small, if possible. In time, those same people might be able to contribute more (get better PC, spread the word etc).

In my opinion, the project should take measured steps, if it doesn't want to alienate many well-intentioned people; that would be a pity.

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One of my machines is a 500mhz with 250 Ram and does just fine. It rarely has an error. It's OS is Windows ME.

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Founder of BOINC GROUP - Objectivists - Philosophically minded rational data crunchers.

Hi All,

Great News about the PR rosetta is starting to generate.

The request for what Rosetta@home does in laymans terms goes to show what I havebeen encountering all along in my pitches to others about DC an R@H in general.

Here is my go at trying to explain in a nutshell what R@H is trying to do and why the plea for more compute:

"The Protien Folding problem first put forth by Linus Pauling in 1936. Still remains to be solved. The solution will lead scientists to a whole new class of drugs for combating diseases like Cancer, Alziemers, Malaria, HIV and various Viruses.

Help us solve this key to treat disease and bring Biological science to new heights. We are only 120 teraflops of computing power away from this goal. With your donation of unused computer cycles we can move one step forward in solving this problem."

Hope this helps feel free to make even simpler or more concise.

Ciao......

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what's a "viable Rosetta cruncher"?

A valid point. (and one of much discussion in existing threads... also kind of a moving target) I don't think we'll entirely resolve that one in a week.

My thought was just to test against the project stated minimums. Factoring in the hours per week you plan to be crunching is a great idea as well. If you tell us your PC is only on 2 hrs per weekday (well... except for Fridays!) so 8hrs per week, and BOINC can only use your PC when you're NOT, well... that doesn't leave much time :)

Once such an applet is created, it could later be added to, perhaps giving a "score" of somekind, or taking additional factors into account. Start with V1.0 and test if project minimums are satisfied or not.

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Add this signature to your EMail:
Running Microsoft's "System Idle Process" will never help cure cancer, AIDS nor Alzheimer's. But running Rosetta@home just might!
https://boinc.bakerlab.org/rosetta/

Perhaps some tie in to the CASP7?? And how it is a science proving ground. And how their PC will help show how science has progressed since CASP6?

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Add this signature to your EMail:
Running Microsoft's "System Idle Process" will never help cure cancer, AIDS nor Alzheimer's. But running Rosetta@home just might!
https://boinc.bakerlab.org/rosetta/

Note: sorry that this is off-topic to the BBC-R@H issue. About the BBC thing, I think you should create a "landing page" with content adapting the UWashington homepage presentation and easy 1-2-3 installation guide at the end (the "account registration at project" step isn't required by BOINC client v5.x anymore).

Once such an applet is created, it could later be added to, perhaps giving a "score" of somekind, or taking additional factors into account. Start with V1.0 and test if project minimums are satisfied or not.

This needs to be *primarily* handled in BOINC scheduler/feeder itself. BOINC knows how much RAM, what CPU the PC has etc.

All new hosts (PCs) would start "small", with short WUs. As BOINC collects more data about a particular host (%time BOINC is running etc, average turnaround time etc) it can increase confidence level and send larger WUs.

But for the truly BIG WUs, projects should ask for user's consent. They shouldn't ASSUME that if my PC has 1GB RAM, I want to let a project use 512MB of it. For this there's need for a BigMem or BigWU flag.

See discussions in Flag to opt-in to run big (200+MB memory) WUs? and Opt-in flags for WU allocation ?? threads, some days ago

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